TheTrenchcoat Chronicles

This day in history: Brenda Spencer

Written by

Trench Reynolds

in

Pat from BelchSpeak was kind enough to send me this link to let me know that 29 years ago today was when Brenda Spencer opened fire on a San Diego elementary school that was across the street from her house. She ended up killing two and wounding nine.

Pat asked me whatever became of her and I directed him to this post from 3 years ago when she was last denied parole.

Pat, in his usual manner, replied…

What? she hasn’t been released yet because she was a child at the time of the shooting and there is not a shred of DNA evidence that says she did it??

Epic.

That’s the difference between now and then. Then there was no debate on what to do with a 16-year-old murderer. She was sentenced to life.

Comments

27 responses to “This day in history: Brenda Spencer”

  1. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    Yeah, but how many states had laws on the table that said they could charge 13 year olds as adults back then? Far as I know in recent times that age has only gone back.

    Reply
  2. BelchSpeak Avatar
    BelchSpeak

    Thats because (pick only one):
    A. Laws are written by alien robots that hate kids.
    B. Laws are written that way just to piss you off and make me laugh.
    C. Society elects legislators to make laws that work for the betterment of society.

    Reply
  3. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    How is jailing a 13 year old for life when it has been shown that it does not act as a deterant working for the betterment of society?

    Reply
  4. BelchSpeak Avatar
    BelchSpeak

    First, there are no 13 year olds who have ever served a life sentence.

    And second, because we as a society demand justice and punishment. We are the collective and we like it that way. Nothing you social outcasts can do about it other than to continue to amuse us.

    Reply
  5. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    First, Lionel Tate and Tyler Edmonds both got life sentences and Tyler Edmonds can still serve life (is awaiting a second trial). Both were 13. Beyond that Christopher Pittman is serving 30 to life, was 12 at the time of the crime and Thomas White, 13, could be looking at 20-30 years. Those are just the ones I know about.

    Second, we as a society demand vengence, justice has very little to do with it. We have had cases where we rule them to be a juvenile one way and an adult another (King brothers case is a perfect example of this, someone was indited for statutory rape for having sex with people that the courts ruled to be adults, I personally think the guy deserved it but am I the only one who thinks WTF there?)

    I personally still believe an eye for an eye will make the whole world blind (or if you prefer the western way of saying it, let ye who is sinless cast the first stone.) And there is not much you can do to change that. I be there are a lot of others like me, even if their voices are marginalized.

    Reply
  6. BelchSpeak Avatar
    BelchSpeak

    So nobody has served the whole life sentence yet? I’m right about that.

    Justice was served in both cases you cite, despite your cries to the contrary, you misquote Jesus out of context, and what you call “marginalized” the rest of society calls “sitting rightly where they belong.”

    Guess what Bryan? If you get the votes, or enough guns you too can change society. Until then, keep it down, will ya? We’re tired of your song.

    Reply
  7. Trench Avatar
    Trench

    And what happened to Lionel Tate after his sentence was reduced? Oh that’s right. He committed armed robbery and got 10-30.

    Reply
  8. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    So what your saying is that no 13 year old was convicted to life when he would have died by now. Yeah, we didn’t try 13 year olds as adults 60 years ago so no one would have died by now. We do still sentence kids as adults all the time though.

    I just find it ironic that someone can be a child in one instance and an adult in another at the exact same time.

    How is it misquoting Jesus out of context when he defends someone sentenced to be put to death? As I recall Moses killed a soldier at a young age, yet he is one of the greatest heroes of the old testement. In fact when you look at the entire bible it is a story of sinners doing great things. No one is sinless after all.

    And I am sure the rich, white, middle aged, protestant, males should have all the power in America, though I think the marginalized should be taken into account every once in a while too.

    Reply
  9. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    He had an adult record after that didn’t he. I am not saying that excuses what he did but I imagine its quite hard to support yourself after you get an adult record in America. Not to mention what sort of education did he get in juve?

    Reply
  10. Trench Avatar
    Trench

    Are you seriously comparing Moses to school shooters and mass murderers? There’s a huge difference between killing an Egyptian slave boss in order to protect another Hebrew and killing several over some perceived social slight or psychosis.

    Reply
  11. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    Oh okay so the quality of life killed matters now, how about Paul aka Saul, is that a good enough comparision for you. As I recall he wrote most of the new testement and had quite a few innocent people killed, and hell, that was in adulthood. If a full grown adult who kills in cold blood can change surely a 13 year old boy can.

    Reply
  12. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    P.S. I only say that the quality of life doesn’t normally seem to matter because as you showed in the Cody Posey case you won’t stick up for a boy who kills someone who is, by all accounts, torturing him.

    Reply
  13. BelchSpeak Avatar
    BelchSpeak

    As soon as Christ appears to those little kids who kill- you know, the kids you love and adore so deeply and want to be their mentor or Indian spiritual guide or whatever- As soon as Christ appears to them and calls upon them to build a new church and causes earthquakes to scare the shit out of the jail guards and all, you let me know. I’ll be on your side then.

    Until then Bryan, they are killers convicted under Man’s laws by a system that is fairer than any other on the planet and generally works very well.

    You are so fond of quoting Jesus, remember that he said to “Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s.” And he said that before talking about giving anything to God. He meant that we must all submit to earthly authority. That includes the courts.

    I told you what it takes to change laws. So get to it and quit your whining, Captain Diapers.

    Reply
  14. BelchSpeak Avatar
    BelchSpeak

    “by all accounts, torturing him.”

    What accounts? You mean the people who knew about Cody’s brutal treatment and then stood by and said nothing to anyone in authority? Those people, those accounts?

    If he dies in jail for shooting his sister in the face, that’s fine with me. All those who thought he was being abused and stood around silently can suck it. Maybe they will speak up next time.

    Or maybe Cody was lying about the abuse.

    Reply
  15. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    I don’t think Jesus had human lives in mind when he made that quote. That quote was simply about the “lawfulness” of giving taxes. Right before that in Matthew 22:17 he was asked quite clearly, “Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay taxes to Ceasar or not?” Quite a bit different then telling them to submit to children being imprisoned for life.

    At least when I take a quote “out of context”, it is still about human lives. Come to think of it I don’t think anywhere in the books on the early church they ever mention putting anyone in jail or killing anyone. Closest they come is exiling someone. If you know of any cases where they did feel free to tell me.

    I realize we are under the earths laws but I have a hard time seeing where the harm of saying where I stand is. Though you really think our system of justice is fairer then any other in the world, how many innocent people do you bet are behind bars right now?

    And if it generally works so well why do we have such a problem with crime, especcially juvenile crime. I believe in many Asian countries there a couple murders every year… there was probably a couple murders here in Iowa yesterday… We have 100 times more kids in jail for life then the rest of the world combined, but the most Trench has ever been able to say is that per capita juvenile Europe is about equal (with no reports to back that up), shouldn’t we have a lot less crime if this system truly does work to deter.

    FYI I think its ironic that you whine about my whining. Though I do have to love your ad homenims they always are classic. Make you sound about 8 years old.

    Reply
  16. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    Yes those accounts, just because they did nothing until tragedy happened didn’t mean they didn’t see the torture happening. I don’t believe I ever once saw an account that said he wasn’t tortured. Cody was lying about the abuse and got a half dozen other people to go along with him… not buying it. Thats another Christian thing I suppose… not punishing the son for the sins of the father.

    Reply
  17. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    Take a look around
    Everything is comin’ down
    Do you hear the subtle sounds
    Of our morality slippin’
    People on the go
    We’ll be reapin’ what we sow
    Yeah we say we want to know
    But I got my suspicions

    Reply
  18. ZappaCrappa Avatar
    ZappaCrappa

    It SHOULD be harder to get a job after a serious adult conviction. I just had this conversation this last weekend with a recently released, 4 year guest of the big house and he said that he was having problems finding a good job. I guess if he had spent more time educating and improving himself instead of spending all of it lifting weights, he probably would have had better success. I didn’t point that little tid bit out to him at the time because he certainly looked like he had spent ALL of his time lifting weights and was pretty much covered in tattoos (several in painful lookinf areas) and looked as if he could break me with a healthy sneeze. I might be a smart ass…but I’m no dumb ass :-O

    Reply
  19. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    Ummm, if he wouldn’t have lifted weights in jail theres always that possibility of getting a nice lil blade in the back. I think being tough serves a purpose in jail. Though you make it sound so easy to get an education in jail, I assume you know how many courses they offer in jail, and how many people are willing to hire you even if you take those courses. I know in many juve places theres nothing but GRE prep and life skills classes offered hate to break it to you, but those classes don’t educate you at all.

    Reply
  20. ZappaCrappa Avatar
    ZappaCrappa

    Jesus christ get a fucking sense of humor! You are just a complete waste of time…no wonder you can’t get laid. Can you add an ignore button to this thing Trench? Christ almighty! And your what….a 22 year old expert in EVERYTHING!?!?!? No wonder you got your ass kicked so much in High School. I never fought anybody I didn’t have to and I bet even I would have wanted to kick your ass. Good grief…

    I know he “entertains” you Trench
    but man….you have the patience of Job.

    Reply
  21. ZappaCrappa Avatar
    ZappaCrappa

    Whew!!!! I feel much better after that.

    Anyway BOBBY….the excon said they had quite an extensive library and programs…go cry elsewhere. Better yet…go teach them yourself…I’m sure they would LOVE you.

    Reply
  22. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    I have a sense of humor with things I find funny, personally I don’t think stereotyping excons is that funny. I am 21 and would hardly qualify myself as an expert in everything, but I have heard enough to know that programs in juve places aren’t exactly extensive. I mean hell Thomas White hasn’t been taught anything in 16 months, how is he going to be ready for the outside world after he gets out if he isn’t taught anything in jail. You want to hurt me, feel free, that says a ton more about you then it does about me.

    You do realize I plan to be a special education teacher when I get out of college. I am sure thats not quite the same as teaching excons but probably a whole lot more difficult then whatever the hell you do (what is that again). Heck I would teach at a juvenile facility if there are any hiring when I get out of college. Weren’t expecting that were you?

    Reply
  23. BelchSpeak Avatar
    BelchSpeak

    Expert in bedwetting and being a virginal bisexual. Expert in defending the worst of society.

    Reply
  24. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    And here is the expert in the ad hominem.

    Reply
  25. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    And last time I checked experts in bedwetting (aka urologists) make way more money then I can ever hope to being a simple teacher.

    Reply
  26. Trench Avatar
    Trench

    Actually I have the wisdom of Solomon, the strength of Hercules, the stamina of Atlas, the power of Zeus, the courage of Achilles, and the speed of Mercury.

    Now if you’ll excuse me I have to pick up my cape from the dry cleaners.

    Reply
  27. Endersdragon Avatar
    Endersdragon

    Just curious, Solomon looks really out of place on that list, the rest I believe are all Greek then you have the Jewish person on there. Looks odd, lol.

    Reply

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