Sean Lennon pleads guilty

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Again, no, not John Lennon’s son.

Ravena man pleads guilty to raping teen he met on MySpace:

I originally posted about Sean Lennon here. He was arrested over the summer for having sex with a 14-year-old girl he met on MySpace. The 21-year-old from Ravena, New York pleaded guilty to one count of Use of a Child in a Sexual Performance and one count of Rape in the Third Degree, both felonies.

Under the terms of the plea bargain, Lennon will serve seven years in prison and ten years post release supervision. He also must to register as a sex offender and have no contact with the victim.

Comments

20 responses to “Sean Lennon pleads guilty”

January 10, 2008

Laurie

Sean Lennon does not deserve this prison sentence. Yes – he committed a crime, and Yes he needs to be punished. But, this is excessive.

There is dual guilt in this situation. Where was the mother of this girl?

I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse, and know that if my parents had more closely monitored my relationships and activities, it may not have happened.

I certainly hope this young girl is getting therapeutic treatment. You can bet Sean will not receive any in prison. New York chooses not to rehabilitate. I hope that when he is released, he will not fall back on what he learns in prison.

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January 10, 2008

Dan

7 years doesn’t seem excessive to me for preying on a kid. Women his age don’t need to sneak out of the house, and if they have any self-respect, they refuse to bang men they just met behind public buildings. Only kids are confused and needy enough for that folly.

Where was the mom? Good question. Kids can be so clever about sneaking around. The only way to know what they’re up to is to be close to them, know them.

Laurie’s right. They need to get their heads screwed on straight with some professional help. But blame can only be placed on the man. Kids make stupid mistakes. Hopefully they have enough caretaking in their lives that those mistakes are not damaging. But if they don’t, they’re not to blame for rotten things adults get them into. They have to take responsibility, face the outcome, but that’s different from blame.

Mistakes are not intentional. Kids just follow their whims till they learn the good ones and the bad ones. Preying is intentional.

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January 10, 2008

David

Here’s an interesting question…There are states where a significant age gap provision exists for consensual sex. For instance say the 14 year old and an 18 year old hooked up…arguably the same amount of coercion was used to get her to consent as 20/21 year old would use.

My question is this: You say that kids screw up all the time and make mistakes that they learn from. If this girl screwed up in a “gap” state where it was legal for her to sleep with an 18 year old, fine. They both made a stupid mistake. Eventually he realizes that she’s way too immature to be in a relationship, and she realizes that sex doesn’t make her feel good about herself. She made the mistake that sex = love and attention, and he made the mistake that a 14 year old girl could actually be ready for sex. Everyone learns a lesson. Great. That same thing happens in a state without an Age Gap provision or in the same state where the age gap is exceeded, and the girl learns the same lesson, but the guy gets put in prison for 7 years and on a sex offender registry for the rest of his life.

So I think Laurie’s point is this: Why is this guy (and society in terms of the productivity they lose from his incarceration and from actually paying for his shelter and food) paying the full price for (at least some) negligence on the caretaker’s part?

I’m not saying 20/21 year olds should be sleeping with 14 year olds, obviously that’s terrible. But there’s a huge difference between a 30 year old trolling myspace for victims, and a 20 year old guy, who could conceivably still have friends in school with this girl.

Not every underage sexual encounter has lifelong harmful consequences…some underage sexual encounters are just harmful in the short term, and are powerful learning experiences. The court shouldn’t assume that every time an underage girl has sex that there’s a child sex predator involved or that the victim has been wrecked psychologically for life. Sometimes it really is just two dumb kids making a dumb mistake…just like they’re supposed to.

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January 10, 2008

Laurie

Yes – David and Dan – I agree with you both.

When I was in High School (yes – back in the day – I am in my 50’s) it was not unusual for 14 year old girls to have older boyfriends. I agree that 21 is too old for a girl this age. He should have known better.
But lets put this in perspective.
He did not murder or strangle a small defenseless child. Yes – he did manipulate a situation with someone younger. And the law is the law. But – it was more of a boyfriend/girlfriend thing, where they were corresponding back and forth, and made dates.

Was this young man ever taught exactly what it would mean if he had sex with a younger girl, under the age of consent? I mean REALLY what it would mean – prison??? The Sex offender registry for the REST of his life? His life is now ruined. Where will his family move to? This will be with him for the rest of his life.

Does he deserve this? As you pointed out David, sometimes ‘kids’ make dumb mistakes.
From discussing this with my friends, many in the same age group or younger, we all experimented with sex and had older boyfriends. Some even took pictures. If our parents would have heard our conversations, it would have curled their hair.

Was the young girl ever taught about sexual issues? How has this impacted her views on men and sex? Is she getting the treatment she needs? What about her peers? They all know what has happened and are watching.

One of my concerns is that other young males who see this result, may feel compelled to do something worse to ensure they do not get ‘caught’.

We need to find some balance on this issue, instead of responding and making laws from gut reactions when we hear of the worst case scenarios.

Parents of young men and women need to educate their children. What do we do with the parents who chose to be ignorant, and do not give their child the benefit of this type of information? Is this fair? And just?

This is a shame.

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January 10, 2008

Dan

14 isn’t a young woman. It’s a girl who is beginning to look like a woman. It’s the last year in middle school or the first year in high school. 21 and 14 year olds do not have “mutual friends.” In fact, well-adjusted 18 year olds rarely have true friends who are 16 year old. Kids change so rapidly that two teens years is a big deal.

A 21 year old man has been out of high school and conducting an adult life for about three years. He works, has a bank account, votes, pays taxes, goes to bars, registers his vehicle, makes his own doctors’ appointments. To a man, a 14 year old feels like a child, feels silly, vulnerable, immature, malleable and pretty annoying much of the time. Of course they can be very pretty and innocent. Predators deal with the annoying part to get at the pretty and vulnerable part. They prefer innocent girls over women their own age because women their age have some sophistication that makes them less fun to dick around. Plus there’s all the prestige in telling your buddies you popped a virgin’s cherry. Awesome you dawg!

Do young men know the consequences? They sure as hell do. It’s a hot topic of discussion. They know the laws better than we do, age gaps and all. They’ve got cute names for baby girls: Jailbait, Hard Candy, Sweetmeat, Lolita, Amaloli, bald kittens, wahinis. Scoring on them is: Doing an “R. Kelly.” Being her daddy. Booty Bandits. Cherry Picker. Nonce. Chicken-chasing for young boys. It’s predatory, a cruel abuse of power, a user’s game. Young girls are the meat these dogs chew up. Normal, well-intentioned 21 year old men fantasize about young women who can keep up with them, not silly young girls they can have their way with and manipulate.

If she was 17 we’d have a discussion, but not 14. You know any 14 year olds? Sheesh. They’re kids. When they try to sound grown up they’re even more ridiculous.

He’s a predator who cut his teeth, a bad landmark. He needs removal and treatment.

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January 10, 2008

L

He photographed it though! He took pictures of a 14 year old having sex. That is child porn.

I think he deserved the sentence. Why on earth would a 21 year old even be talking to 14 year olds? It’s not normal.

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January 10, 2008

Dan

When you were in school, Laurie, men had society pretty much set up to their advantage. Just because something is “how things are” doesn’t mean it’s how they ought to be. White men set the norms in this country, to our advantage. Would you let your 14 year old go out alone with a 21 year old? 15? 16? 21 year olds have sex as a matter of routine. It’s normal and healthy in a balanced relationship. 14 year olds spend months kissing, cooing about forever, arguing tempestuously. They need deserve that stage of development to be healthy. They do not need to be thrust into sex with grown men a moment before they’re ready to handle it. This idea that it’s not so bad once a girl is developed and has some sexual feelings is a fiction perpetuated by a male culture so it’s ok when we score pretty young flesh.

I personally resent the underlying message that all men are consuming predators at some level and girls and women are at fault when they get tore up. Because men, aren’t we really dogs deep down? Fuck that. Girls are not secretly candy to all of us. They are children we care about even if they are pretty. Women are people to us, not potential sex meat, even if they’re attractive. Sexual desire in men does not mean we are dogs. When one of acts like a dog, we need decry his behavior strongly.

I counsel girls like this. They are a hurt bunch, all of them, who generally feel like crap about themselves. They have a lot of apathy and self-abuse. I do not see them do well once they are adults.

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January 10, 2008

Dan

When you bang a cherry, you take pictures for a trophy and show your boys.

Besides, have her on film and she’s even more your thing.

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January 11, 2008

Laurie

If you new Sean and the victim, you would have a better idea of what happened. They both live in the same town, and know each other. Sean is a very immature 21 year old. The victim is a very mature 14 year old. Having said that, I am in no way defending what happened, or saying that the girl is to blame. I am saying, however, that when you have a young man and a young girl of these ages, we should make darn well sure they know the laws and exactly what it means. Many people have taken picture of their sexual escapades, that does not mean that they are all pornography. Young men and women in school, DO NOT KNOW THE CONSEQUENCES!!!! OUR SCHOOLS DO NOT TEACH THIS!!!!

SO, what do we do with the youth that are uninformed?? Are there parents teaching them?? Ha – what a joke. Most parents have their own sexuality issues and do not want to touch this subject.

It is Dan’s thoughts as expressed above that are disgusting and what comes to mind when we hear this type of crime and the details blasted all over the newspapers and TV.

So now what happens? Again – is the young woman getting counseling? Is Sean going to receive the help he needs?

We need to rethink this whole situation….instead of throwing people away, or sending them off to prison so they can learn to be a better criminal.

We should not lump all instances of sexual related behavior of this type together. We need to separate the true pedophiles and offenders from kids making dumb mistakes.

I live in this town, and know the people involved. That DOES make a difference. Sean is not a predator!!!!

This young man is NOT a predator. This was a girlfriend/boyfriend type relationship. Parents need to step up to the plate and be more responsible for what their kids are taught, and what their kids are doing. Instead of always blaming someone else when something bad happens.

This is a 21 year old, who had a life, who no longer has a life because he was stupid and made a BIG mistake. I do not think it warrants having your name on the Predator Database. He is NOT a predator. And, this young girl desperately needs treatment so she does not find herself in the same position again.

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January 11, 2008

Laurie

One other note, I know of a young man who was drinking and driving at the age of 21, got in an accident, and killed someone. He was sentenced to 7 years in prison….go figure. He gets to walk out of prison without his name being published on a ‘murderer’ database, and can resume his life, if he has learned his lesson. Given the brevity of both of these ‘crimes’ it seems unjust to dole out the same sentence.

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January 12, 2008

Dan

14 year old girls are never, ever “young women,” even if they posture well. Young girls don’t want to get banged behind firestations. Sorry guys. Sometimes girls think it’s the best they can do in the pursuit of True Love, but they are not girls-gone-wild nymphos. In fact, girls gone wild nyphos don’t really want to get banged in public by freaky dudes either, it’s just a lie we taught them to be appealing to men.

Communities often defend these “nice young men.” This type of denial get’s us nowhere. I think it’s our tendency to see in black and white that prevents us from helping these young men before their predatory urges are formed and indulged.

I constantly advocate for intervention, acceptance, forgiveness. Does Sean preying on this child make him evil? Hell no. It makes him a selfish asshole jerk. Young men tend to promote and celebrate assholedom among themselves these days. His asshole behavior just went criminal. I counsel these confused young assholes. They are not irredeemable. But they need serious work. They need to be removed from the environment that promotes this behavior. And once they act on predatory pedophilic or ephebophilic fantasies, it’s much tougher to counsel them to change.

He’ll be among us again. He does need serious intervention. Without the hope of forgiveness, he won’t take change into his own hands. He’ll harden. And what we do that is the number one inhibitor of change for them is defend their criminal behavior, cry unfair for them. They need genuine, gut level remorse if change is a possibility. If we bolster him in justifications, “he’s immature, he didn’t know any better, the child was woman-like,” he will not change. He needs to face the severity of what he’s done. He needs a moment where he boldly faces the hurtful impulses in him, breaks down in violent sobs and is deeply sorry. He needs that and we should not deny him.

Any number of shitty behaviors can be justified. This does not help people. It hinders them, diminishes their conscience by suggesting they are victims of unfairness. We need to be able to hate the shitty act and still love the person. Because it’s hard to see things as other than good or bad, it’s hard to admit when a person with many decent and good impulses does something so bad. Well, people do bad things.
People need a chance to be forgiven.

So it’s the 7 years that’s the outrage? Or you want peoples’ relative immaturity judged when men offend? Goodness, I know some 32 year olds clinging to immaturity……

Well, prison is no place for anyone with any conscience left. Sociopaths, yes, they do not belong among us. But I must tell you, most prisoners have conscience that can still be accessed. We crush it out of them in prison. The prison system could be much more effective, could address real needs of people who will live among us. Counseling is crucial, but then so are productivity and endeavors that help people see themselves as valuable and good.

If this young man could be someplace where he could be counseled, work, learn, well then we’d have someone among us in a few years we’d know would be unlikely to look at the vulnerable as sexual objects. And he could be redeemed. I wish that were possible. I wish that was our system.

7 years? well, I’m not sure of these things, but doesn’t that mean he’ll be out in 3 or 4? That seems about right. It was serious crime. Chilren are not sexual objects and this girl is badly hurt. Without a humane, effective system for helping people change and attain an acceptible level of humanity for our society, we’re on the defensive. With this system, the best we can do is get people away from potential victims for as long as possible. It’s pretty unevolved, but it’s the best we’ve got. Sean banged a Wahini in this society. His choice, and a very bad one.

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January 12, 2008

Dan

Yes, Laurie, all that cherry busting talk is “disgusting,’ isn’t it? Sorry if it was too much. That’s how these young men talk. They know full well what they’re deciding to do and photograph to share with their friends. Disgusting is right. It doesn’t help us to remain ignorant of this ugly little slice of culture. We really have to put our foot down about it.

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January 13, 2008

Laurie

Dan – you obviously have a particular person in mind when you write. I believe you are talking about predators. You do not have all the facts on THIS particular case. Not all 21 years old that get caught in this situation are perverted.
Young adults do stupid things, and some men view woman as sexual conquests. No – not all men. And men that do may not be perverted either. Some are misguided – I am not talking about true predators.

This was the same girl, the same guy. Sean did not ‘prey’ on young ‘girls’. The young woman is not a nymph, she is very confused, just as Sean is very confused.

She needs guidance in what exactly her sexuality means. She needs to find something else to do with that energy. Where are the people that need to help her? I hope they are there for her – namely parents. What happens when she goes to school? Is she now locked in to this kind of future? Meeting at first boys, and now immature and inexperienced twenty one year old men? Or, will she end up pregnant in a year or two? Chances are she has learned some type of behavior already that promotes sexual exploration. How can we help her? We need to stop this cycle.

If Sean does not get the help he needs, after going to prison he could become a real predator. So, the question becomes how are we going to make sure that does not happen?

Education, monitoring, and support.

You sound very angry. Your lack of compassion all the way around suggests you have been in this field too long, if indeed, you do counsel. I would hesitate to ask you for support.

I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse and know all too well how the cycle works.

Chance are without intervention, counseling and help, both these young individuals will lead lives that will have a large self destructive component that will spill out onto other people.

In one of your earlier responses, you stated that when I went to school, men had society set up to their advantage. They still do. I believe you are a man, and you think you know it all. With a know it all attitude, there is nothing to be learned and we will be stuck with this same old problem that has been around for centuries.

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January 17, 2008

Dan

I’m afraid you are innocent of the pervasiveness of the cherry-banging culture among young men. It’s pretty big time stuff, very pervasive. Our horror is not adequately aroused or we would respond with the appropriate horror these desensitized young men need.

Counseling is tremendously important. And I am not too keen on punishment as a tool. But when a man is 21 in our culture, he has to face the consequences of his actions as we’ve set them out. Choosing sexually immature girls is predatory by nature. He has created a very big mess for himself. Unless of course he has some diminished mental capacity, but I have not heard that, though that does seem to be what you’re implying.

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January 22, 2008

James BBB

I dont care if Sean is a celeb or not, everything works the same.

But, as usual the law demonstrates itself as non-working. Its a stupid law to make people believe that it’s a crime to have sex with a teenager that is willing to have it. The teenage years is puberty time when sex moves to the front burner. If anything teens are better off having sex with older people because of the typical recklessness of young boys. SOmeone on a forum talked about how Younger women and Older men vs. Older women and Younger men would create a better scenerio all the way around. I agree with this.

I was 15 when I had sex with my High school teacher. After what I did to her she could call it rape. HAHA. We both loved doing each other and I learned a lot. She taught me a lot. No law in the world can justify the idea it was wrong. You cannot legislate morality without screwing up people’s lives.

I am here to say to every person over 21 out there. HAVE SEX WITH AS MANY TEENAGERS AS YOU CAN. To hell with the laws. They need to be changed.

I almost forgot to mention that when I turned 24 I married a 17 year old girl. Weve been together for more than 10 years since then with two kids. There are just lots of ignorant bastards in this world who have nothing better to do than judge others and take action to try and justify it.

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January 22, 2008

HermesGabe

They did nothing wrong. That law is no different than living under a harsh dictatorship in another country. Religion and Cult(ure) feed these laws and the minds of people who follow them.

I agree with Laurie about the idea that Sean was immature and the girl was mature. It’s mostly irrelevant to me but still valid none of the less. All it proves though is that young teenage girls are grown up enough to make decisions while thinking of the outcome. You typically hear in the news about young girls being totally reckless, like Britney Spears and whoever. But, those are example of homes that have immature parents who either don’t care for the well being of their kids -or- can’t care due to being self absorbed.

It has nothing to do with age alone. There is a large growing number of young girls who are very wise. History is another thing that dictates. It shows that for many centuries teenage girls have not only had sex, but had children and got married. NOT ONCE did it result in tragedy because of age.

We should wake up and realize that Ameica and any other individualistic society represses SEX and puts shame on it. They try to define it as something other than what it truly is. They mask it with Christian ideas calling it “sacred” and “holy”. BLAH BLAH BLAH.

All the other animla sin this world don’t follow such foolish nonsense. What do you think the first man did when he saw creatures procreating? Just like a little boy, he mirrored his surroundings. Forget about the Adam and Eve mumbo jumbo. Science has proven many things and the ignorance of politicians and the law continues to ruin people’s lives by ignoring the facts.

I have two daughters. And before too long one of them will be a teenager. I am not certain what she may do with her life. But I know I will not only be there for her, but I won’t ruin someone else’s life just because they pissed me off. I won’t do the law a favor. I take law into my own hands according to my beliefs. Forget the laws and watch them die. Like religion, they thrive on intimidation and fear. Like the guy above said. You cannot legislate morality. This I fully agree with.

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January 23, 2008

Dan

No tragedy ever came of those teen girls marrying and bearing children? Really? You are one of those who decries history as bullshit? The oppression and socially acceptible abuse of women is basic history. Remember when westerners magically discovered, oh, women aren’t just recepticles, they might enjoy sex too?

People here aren’t saying sex and sexuality are bad at all, just an advantageous power differential.

An adult can talk a kid into almost anything he or she wants. I could get almost any kid in America to give me his or her xbox. They are vulnerable and they do not yet know their own minds.

This is a problem of not seeing subtleties, insisting on either horror or health. Did teen marriages detroy 15 year old frontier girls? No, it’s what was done. They worked every day all day until they died young. The race survived.

We are more evolved creatures now. We have the resources to discover and promote the healthiest, most advantageous course of development.

We’re not monkeys. I hate when people insist animal behavior is acceptible just because it was all that was available to us in the past.

We can legislate morality. We do. It’s our society. Notice how angry everyone gets when someone commits a crime against someone weaker? We don’t want people with as yet unformed minds being preyed on by adults, so we don’t permit it.

Sean had choices, perhaps women his own age. He chose preying on a kid and photographing her. A crime here.

People so weak and so hot for the vulnerable should move to an underdeveloped country where it is still approved of, where animal behavior is still engaged in as the resources of the country are inadequate to support more evolved behavior. Hurry though. Hopefully someday children used as adults’ sexual objects will be a heinous crime everywhere.

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January 25, 2008

Laurie

I agree with both of you – Dan and Hermes.

Dan, It sounds like you are basing everything on just your experience. And that is fine, but there are so many people out there, and may ways of looking at things.

I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse. Part of the reason it was so traumatic for me was because my parents did not know how to deal with it – they never talked about it – it being sex or sexuality, and abuse. When it was finally acknowledged, years after, the language that was used was ‘oh boys are going to think they can do that to you ‘ and ‘If I had known that was happening to you I would have done something about it’. There were never questions asked, nothing was ever explained to me. What I learned I learned from friends and a very limited health course in school. I know things are very different today.

In today’s world, sex is splashed all over the place. Women are more dehumanized than when I was a child. Or, at least it wasn’t broadcast all over the place when I was growing up. This kid has his own computer. Are his parents keeping on eye on what he is doing? And the same can be said for the victim in this case. Where were her parents?

My son (who is now 22) told me he saw a movie on a PC at his friends house when he was around 12 years old, and the movie showed a man F**king a chicken. Can you imagine????

I am very open and honest with my kids because I did not want them to get in the same situations I did out of ignorance. Many choices I made as a teenager were bad choices, because of the abuse that occurred, and because of the responses I received from many people about women, sex, sexuality etc. My mind certainly wasn’t where it should have been, and I did not have a good guide.

Anyway – even though I kept an eye on my kids at home, and checked on where they were going and what they were doing, my son was still exposed to this type of garbage, and much worse probably. I have had open and honest discussions with my kids for years about sexuality and responsibility, empathy with self respect.

Again I ask, who is teaching children what is right and wrong? Especially about sex?

Until we have clear lines defined and the knowledge of EXACTLY what that means, we will never put a dent in sex crimes, and until all people have this information on an equal basis our system will remain unjust.

We can try to legislate morality, but if people aren’t on the same page and buy into that morality it will never work.

Some of our own lawmakers commit these types of crimes everyday, teachers, lawyers, mothers, fathers etc. We are in such a state of denial, we have made ourselves very sick. But we are adults. When you are dealing with an immature 21 year old male, it is a different story. Especially one from a small town. What did his parents teach him? What did school teach him? What is society teaching him? If he has this ‘problem’, what good will locking him up for 7 years or less, do in the long run?

We are still very ‘back in the day’ with our attitudes about sex. I do not condone sex with children – I don’t and that crime for me personally, is the worst.

This is a 14 year old. This young woman was tricked or manipulated, and couldn’t get out of the situation, so she gave in. The young man was manipulating the situation, not seeing it from anyone else’s eyes, and only using the head between his legs.

Many woman have been tricked or manipulated into situations they feel they could not get out of, unless they had sex with the man. And, yes, it is a crime. But, is every man that tricked or manipulated a woman into sex a predator?

Depending on the treatment this young woman receives, hopefully she will continue to grow and not be stuck in this trauma. We need to think about the role models she has as well.

I question who we are calling predators. Just because you learn about sex and sexuality, does not mean you have to ‘do it’. Most people have sexual urges on and off every day throughout the day – maybe that is what part of the problem is, so many of us adults are numbing ourselves by drinking or taking anti-depressants that we forgot what urges feel like, unless they are out of control.

This is such a complicated issue, and I am very happy to read so many blogs on this subject. It is encouraging.

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February 22, 2008

nikki

I hope you don’t mean John Lennon’s son because that will break my heart because of being related to the guy in some way.

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February 22, 2008

Trench

No, it’s a different Sean Lennon. I believe John Lennon’s son is in his 30’s or 40’s by now.

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